32: Chris Sacca - Drifting Back to Real

In hockey, you get five minutes to reflect, then you're back on the ice. But I thought, wait. Crystal and I have worked extensively to help people. Did you ever come with us to prison? We helped her. We've worked on helping. California used brain science to pass a law allowing anyone sentenced to die in prison for a crime committed under the age of 25 to be eligible for resentencing. Not necessarily freed; not everyone should be. However, some people committed horrible acts at 16, often due to terrible circumstances. We now know the frontal cortex isn't fully formed until around 25 or 26. There's clear science on that.

Sometimes, risk is mispriced, often rooted in narrative, fear, imposter syndrome, and underestimating one's ability to impact outcomes. I was once asked what all our most successful founders have in common. I searched for a common thread. It wasn't their upbringing. Immigrant children, for instance, demonstrate incredible hustle, desire, and focus due to the challenges they overcome. Similarly, individuals raised by single parents often possess the same fire, adaptability, and resilience. I considered various factors: Are they scientists? Computer scientists? Did they sell products as children? Many did, but not all. The single commonality among our most successful founders is that they never prepared for a downside scenario; it simply wasn't an option in their calculations.

Crystal and I had the same reaction: "No dessert for you! Stand up right now and immediately go back to that meeting." They were surprised, asking, "Wait, really?" We explained, "If we invest in normal people, all this money will disappear. The alpha is in the weirdos. Immediately go back there." They questioned, "Seriously? But what he's doing is crazy." I responded, "Yes, he's literally trying to make it rain. That's exactly why we need to talk to him. There might be political fallout, and we might be the target of conspiracy theorists. We knew that then. But that guy sounds so unlike anyone else I've ever heard about. Go back there." All the things they were talking about weren't toxic; they were just weird.

The actual productivity, specifically the net energy gains, had begun to increase exponentially, even double exponentially, where the exponent itself is an exponent. However, when we discussed this with people outside the fusion industry, their response was, "That's where dreams go to die. All your money will be wasted." We realized that those expressing such skepticism simply hadn't visited a lab recently. If you speak with the people working on this and visit the companies, you'll see it's incredible. They're using the world's largest magnets to achieve temperatures of 150 million degrees Celsius, hotter than the sun. It's truly impressive.

Patrick and John have each other. Whether you call it dialectic—a word I had to look up to understand your podcast's name—that's who they are. They keep each other incredibly honest in their thinking and as people. My wife, Crystal, is the silent co-founder of everything I've ever done. We've been best friends since we were 18. She friend-zoned me for 14 years, but three kids later, she's the first person daily to tell me, "You're so full of shit," or "That is a tired idea," or "I disagree," or "You're missing the point," or "Are you serious with that right now?"

I worry that too many people lack agency, resilience, adaptability, and initiative. As a friend once put it, they ask for permission to solve a problem. Crystal and I immediately understood. In a 30-person Zoom meeting, they announce they're going to the bathroom. I think, "You're a professional. You make hundreds of thousands of dollars a year and lead investments worth hundreds of millions. Just go. Turn off your camera." If you turn off your camera, I'll assume it's for a good reason. I've trusted you to run a part of the business; you don't need to update us on your bladder's status. You've now imposed that cost on 32 people.

Larry Page, engrossed in his BlackBerry, didn't even look up. He simply asked, "But what did Chris say that wasn't true?" It was clear my departure was already decided. He pressed, "I'm serious, tell me what Chris said that wasn't true." After a silence, he continued, "They are inserting themselves between us and our users. We've never stood for that. Everything we do is to prevent Internet Explorer from resetting your search default, ensuring a direct relationship with our users. Similarly, with Firefox, we ensure users have a choice and can always come to us, winning on the merits of our product. That's everything we do." He concluded, "So tell me what's wrong with what he said? It may upset people because it's true."